Date
1 - 18 of 18
RG8 Co-ax that can be buried?
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Guys/Gals,
A bit of technical help please? Does anyone know of a quality RG8 co-ax that can be buried? I have about a 30' run that goes to my tower. It either has to be buried 4" to 6" under the lawn, or sleved in 4" pvc pipe with weather heads on each end. The labor is a big difference for me. (And my gardener) Looking down the road a bit, it's a huge hassle to do the pvc pipe since the addition of antenna's to my tower would require a 'fish tape' or strong cord in the tubing to pull additional co-ax runs through. Experienced help pls? Milt. N6MG 070-650
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Bob N3PPH <rsheskin@...>
Check RG-213, ground contact rated and I have it direct buried (no conduit)
for a few years with no problems. It is the same size as RG-8. 73, Bob N3PPH From: 070@... [mailto:070@...] On Behalf Of w6qe.milt Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 10:09 AM To: 070@... Subject: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? Guys/Gals, A bit of technical help please? Does anyone know of a quality RG8 co-ax that can be buried? I have about a 30' run that goes to my tower. It either has to be buried 4" to 6" under the lawn, or sleved in 4" pvc pipe with weather heads on each end. The labor is a big difference for me. (And my gardener) Looking down the road a bit, it's a huge hassle to do the pvc pipe since the addition of antenna's to my tower would require a 'fish tape' or strong cord in the tubing to pull additional co-ax runs through. Experienced help pls? Milt. N6MG 070-650
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ABR Industries sells good quality coax rated for direct burial:
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https://www.abrind.com/Home/CoaxGuide 73 de NF8I, ~James
--- In 070@..., "w6qe.milt" <n6mg@...> wrote:
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Lee A. Ratcliff <lratcliff@...>
I would recommend the Conduit. Go at least twice as big as you think you need. when you put it in, put in runs of good nylon sting from one end of the conduit to the other, and just leave them there. As long as they don’t get tangled, you can pull more runs through later on. Much easier than digging a trench each time you want to add a run of coax.
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Lee KC4ART
-----Original Message-----
From: w6qe.milt Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 10:08 AM To: 070@... Subject: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? Guys/Gals, A bit of technical help please? Does anyone know of a quality RG8 co-ax that can be buried? I have about a 30' run that goes to my tower. It either has to be buried 4" to 6" under the lawn, or sleved in 4" pvc pipe with weather heads on each end. The labor is a big difference for me. (And my gardener) Looking down the road a bit, it's a huge hassle to do the pvc pipe since the addition of antenna's to my tower would require a 'fish tape' or strong cord in the tubing to pull additional co-ax runs through. Experienced help pls? Milt. N6MG 070-650 ------------------------------------ Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities. Yahoo! Groups Links
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Karen Russo
They do make a direct burial LMR 400. Ask Janet, she probably has it.
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Karen W4KRN Sent via DroidX2 on Verizon Wirelessâ„¢
-----Original message-----
From: "Lee A. Ratcliff" <lratcliff@...> To: 070@... Sent: Fri, Nov 9, 2012 00:53:46 GMT+00:00 Subject: Re: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? I would recommend the Conduit. Go at least twice as big as you think you need. when you put it in, put in runs of good nylon sting from one end of the conduit to the other, and just leave them there. As long as they don’t get tangled, you can pull more runs through later on. Much easier than digging a trench each time you want to add a run of coax. Lee KC4ART -----Original Message----- From: w6qe.milt Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 10:08 AM To: 070@... Subject: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? Guys/Gals, A bit of technical help please? Does anyone know of a quality RG8 co-ax that can be buried? I have about a 30' run that goes to my tower. It either has to be buried 4" to 6" under the lawn, or sleved in 4" pvc pipe with weather heads on each end. The labor is a big difference for me. (And my gardener) Looking down the road a bit, it's a huge hassle to do the pvc pipe since the addition of antenna's to my tower would require a 'fish tape' or strong cord in the tubing to pull additional co-ax runs through. Experienced help pls? Milt. N6MG 070-650 ------------------------------------ Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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LMR400 direct burial is the way to go.  Not all LMR400 is direct burial unless it's specified. LMR400 has little loss at HF frequencies. BUT, it should come with connectors already installed. The compression connectors are a bit more expensive, but not as much as the tool needed to install connectors (around $400 !).
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PVC pipe, if used, should be at least 3-4" in diameter with sweep 90 degree elbows (or two 45 degree elbows) because pulling coax through PVC can be a chore even with pull strings !  Direct burial cable is cheapest route as long as there are no coax nibbling critters in yard !  Also, make sure the path for cable is well known/marked; so, some industrious gardener doesn't plant a bunch of daisies on top of coax ... had a MATV antenna system in Lake Geneva condo development that was dug up by weekend gardeners who cut right through coax with shovels, etc. If utilities are underground in your yard, you may want to have J.U.L.I.E. or whatever you have to locate underground AC, cable, etc. Here in Illinois that service is free. Placing coax too close to underground power wires is not recommended. Think that covers it. Jerry n9avy
--- On Thu, 11/8/12, Karen Russo <w4krn@...> wrote:
From: Karen Russo <w4krn@...> Subject: Re: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? To: 070@... Date: Thursday, November 8, 2012, 7:44 PM  They do make a direct burial LMR 400. Ask Janet, she probably has it. Karen W4KRN Sent via DroidX2 on Verizon Wireless™ -----Original message----- From: "Lee A. Ratcliff" <lratcliff@...> To: 070@... Sent: Fri, Nov 9, 2012 00:53:46 GMT+00:00 Subject: Re: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? I would recommend the Conduit. Go at least twice as big as you think you need. when you put it in, put in runs of good nylon sting from one end of the conduit to the other, and just leave them there. As long as they don’t get tangled, you can pull more runs through later on. Much easier than digging a trench each time you want to add a run of coax. Lee KC4ART -----Original Message----- From: w6qe.milt Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 10:08 AM To: 070@... Subject: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? Guys/Gals, A bit of technical help please? Does anyone know of a quality RG8 co-ax that can be buried? I have about a 30' run that goes to my tower. It either has to be buried 4" to 6" under the lawn, or sleved in 4" pvc pipe with weather heads on each end. The labor is a big difference for me. (And my gardener) Looking down the road a bit, it's a huge hassle to do the pvc pipe since the addition of antenna's to my tower would require a 'fish tape' or strong cord in the tubing to pull additional co-ax runs through. Experienced help pls? Milt. N6MG 070-650 ------------------------------------ Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Robert Johnstone
I pushed rg8 through 1.5" conduit 20ft with 2 fingers, but then I left it elevated to clear the mower along a wood fence. Â Would not recommend for the world above 50. but fine for HF.
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RG-8/u or RG8X ???  20 ft with no bends is easy, but add a couple 90 degree bends and double the distance ... it's a whole ball game ! Â
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Been pulling lots of big cables through conduit for many years. Coax can present different problems especially if one has to pull connectors from a pre-made coax. Lots of years of working n tower/antenna projects everything from 50 ft. to 190 ft. . One thing I've learned is to always over-engineer things and to be prepared for unexpected. Just saying that every situation is different and sometimes what looks easy, isn't. Jerry N9AVY
--- On Thu, 11/8/12, Robert Johnstone <shopr3@...> wrote:
From: Robert Johnstone <shopr3@...> Subject: Re: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? To: "070@..." <070@...> Date: Thursday, November 8, 2012, 9:43 PM  I pushed rg8 through 1.5" conduit 20ft with 2 fingers, but then I left it elevated to clear the mower along a wood fence.  Would not recommend for the world above 50. but fine for HF. ________________________________ From: Lee A. Ratcliff <lratcliff@...> To: 070@... Sent: Thursday, November 8, 2012 6:53 PM Subject: Re: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried?  I would recommend the Conduit. Go at least twice as big as you think you need. when you put it in, put in runs of good nylon sting from one end of the conduit to the other, and just leave them there. As long as they don’t get tangled, you can pull more runs through later on. Much easier than digging a trench each time you want to add a run of coax. Lee KC4ART -----Original Message----- From: w6qe.milt Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 10:08 AM To: 070@... Subject: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? Guys/Gals, A bit of technical help please? Does anyone know of a quality RG8 co-ax that can be buried? I have about a 30' run that goes to my tower. It either has to be buried 4" to 6" under the lawn, or sleved in 4" pvc pipe with weather heads on each end. The labor is a big difference for me. (And my gardener) Looking down the road a bit, it's a huge hassle to do the pvc pipe since the addition of antenna's to my tower would require a 'fish tape' or strong cord in the tubing to pull additional co-ax runs through. Experienced help pls? Milt. N6MG 070-650 ------------------------------------ Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Jeff Steinkamp
On 11/08/2012 08:08 AM, w6qe.milt wrote:
Guys/Gals,Depending on the acid content of your soil, you might be better off, in the long run, to install the run of 4 inch PVC with a chase tape installed for future coax runs. -- Jeff K. Steinkamp (N7YG) Tucson, AZ Scud Missile Coordinates N32.229 W110.875
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Arthur Peters <k0acp@...>
For what it's worth, I too concur with the over-engineering - perhaps it
is just the latent EE in my trying to escape ... I have used LMR400 DB inside a 4" pvc conduit, I have both installed the runs in the conduit as I built it and I've used nylon drawcord. BTW that new silicon survival tape makes a great way of temporarily "bonding" the cord to the coax. For me, I use Times compression UHF connectors -- available from Tessco. This is a tad more expensive, but i've never had failure -- aside from a mole/ chipmunk that broke into the buried conduit and chewed the coax -- I could tell the little rascal by his perm perm ... hi hi Good luck Milt & please let us know how the project turns out. 73, Art 070# 1140 LONP # 164 K0ACP@... On Nov 8, 2012, at 11:38 PM, Jerry wrote: RG-8/u or RG8X ??? 20 ft with no bends is easy, but add a couple 90 degree bends and double the distance ... it's a whole ball game ! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Thanks Art, et al
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May I ask what you guys are referring to as "compression fittings"? Crimped? I have a ton of RG-213-U, double shielded coax here already in long lengths, and some soft LMR-400. There's a stiff LMR-400 and a softer LMR-400. I guess I need to spend time researching those. I do know this: I want to make as continuous a run as possible from the shack to the antenna's. Inserting a splice with a barrel connector is loss. It's so easy to lose a db and so difficult to gain a db. The only panacea I can come up with is a continuous run. Milt. N6MG 070-650
----- Original Message -----
From: "Arthur Peters" <k0acp@...> To: <070@...> Sent: Friday, November 09, 2012 7:25 AM Subject: Re: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? For what it's worth, I too concur with the over-engineering - perhaps it is just the latent EE in my trying to escape ... I have used LMR400 DB inside a 4" pvc conduit, I have both installed the runs in the conduit as I built it and I've used nylon drawcord. BTW that new silicon survival tape makes a great way of temporarily "bonding" the cord to the coax. For me, I use Times compression UHF connectors -- available from Tessco. This is a tad more expensive, but i've never had failure -- aside from a mole/ chipmunk that broke into the buried conduit and chewed the coax -- I could tell the little rascal by his perm perm ... hi hi Good luck Milt & please let us know how the project turns out. 73, Art 070# 1140 LONP # 164 K0ACP@... On Nov 8, 2012, at 11:38 PM, Jerry wrote: RG-8/u or RG8X ??? 20 ft with no bends is easy, but add a couple 90 degree bends and double the distance ... it's a whole ball game ! ------------------------------------ Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities. Yahoo! Groups Links
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Arthur Peters <k0acp@...>
Milt,
The compression fittings for me are crimp fittings that require a crimping tool: here are some links to what I use: for the connector: https://www.tessco.com/products/displayProductInfo.do?sku=419089 for the crimp: https://www.tessco.com/products/displayProductInfo.do?sku=54250 I also splurged and purchased the prep tool which seems to no longer be available; however here is their new, improved (and more expensive tool...): https://www.tessco.com/products/displayProductInfo.do?sku=315538&eventGroup=4&eventPage=1 here is the cable: http://www.showmecables.com/category/Low-Loss-Bulk-Cable.aspx I will also include all this disclaimers ... I do not have anything to do with Tessco or or times. .... 73, Art 070# 1140 LONP # 164 K0ACP@... On Nov 9, 2012, at 10:36 AM, Milton Garb wrote: Thanks Art, et al [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Art,
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Thanks for the info. Milt.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Arthur Peters" <k0acp@...> To: <070@...> Sent: Friday, November 09, 2012 9:15 AM Subject: Re: [070] RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? Milt, The compression fittings for me are crimp fittings that require a crimping tool: here are some links to what I use: for the connector: https://www.tessco.com/products/displayProductInfo.do?sku=419089 for the crimp: https://www.tessco.com/products/displayProductInfo.do?sku=54250 I also splurged and purchased the prep tool which seems to no longer be available; however here is their new, improved (and more expensive tool...): https://www.tessco.com/products/displayProductInfo.do?sku=315538&eventGroup=4&eventPage=1 here is the cable: http://www.showmecables.com/category/Low-Loss-Bulk-Cable.aspx I will also include all this disclaimers ... I do not have anything to do with Tessco or or times. .... 73, Art 070# 1140 LONP # 164 K0ACP@... On Nov 9, 2012, at 10:36 AM, Milton Garb wrote: Thanks Art, et al ------------------------------------ Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities. Yahoo! Groups Links
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Ross Primrose <n4rp@...>
Frank, W3LPL, who has one of the biggest contest stations on the east
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coast, recommends Davis BuryFlex in his presentations at Contest University... 73, Ross N4RP
On 11/8/2012 10:08 AM, w6qe.milt wrote:
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FCC Section 97.313(a) "At all times, an amateur station must use the minimum transmitter power necessary to carry out the desired communications."
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Mark - N8MNI
I used 3" Schedule 40 PVC to run my coax through into the house. I used
this box in 12"x12"x6" http://www.carlonsales.com/techinfo/brochures/conduit/Junction_Boxes_Brochure.pdf Inside the box is my lightning protectors connected to a copper bar, then 18" run to 8' ground rod. I have 5 runs of LMR400 into the shack. The reason I installed this set up is due to a direct lightning strike I took in 2007. The lightning hit my G5RV, an down the coax, then where the coax curved along the house. The lightning blew out the side of the coax, skipped across the attic to a ceiling light, then followed the electric line in the house back to the outlet in the wall and blew the outlet. -- 73, N8MNI Mark Crosbie London, Ohio PODXS 070# 0525 PODXS Clubhouse Barkeep PODXS Reflector Boss
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Jerry Schempp-- WA0HPN <wa0hpn@...>
The conduit is a good idea, but be aware. When I did this at a former
employment, the first couple of runs went in fine, then the rope or fish started to wrap around the coax. made for very very hard pulls. Also, be careful that you don't put too many bends in the conduit. If you have two 90's you may be ok, but any more than that, you will start pulling against the conduit and it will be almost (not quite) impossible to get another run through it. -- *Jerry Schempp WAØHPN Bismarck, ND * http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm?WA0HPN [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Care must be taken on number of bends... simple math ...2 x 90 degree bend = 180 degrees; so you're almost pulling cable back towards you.  With 4 90 degree bends you'll be pulling in a circle.  Â
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The idea is to avoid 90 degree bends and use 45 degree bends which are gentler. Sharp angles make for tough pulling. Absolutely correct on pull strings/ropes... they will wind around cable at times. Jerry N9AVY
--- On Sun, 11/11/12, Jerry Schempp-- WA0HPN <wa0hpn@...> wrote:
From: Jerry Schempp-- WA0HPN <wa0hpn@...> Subject: [070] Re: RG8 Co-ax that can be buried? To: 070@... Date: Sunday, November 11, 2012, 2:56 PM  The conduit is a good idea, but be aware. When I did this at a former employment, the first couple of runs went in fine, then the rope or fish started to wrap around the coax. made for very very hard pulls. Also, be careful that you don't put too many bends in the conduit. If you have two 90's you may be ok, but any more than that, you will start pulling against the conduit and it will be almost (not quite) impossible to get another run through it. -- *Jerry Schempp WAØHPN Bismarck, ND * http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm?WA0HPN [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Phil Barnett <philb@...>
On Thu, 2012-11-08 at 15:08 +0000, w6qe.milt wrote:
Guys/Gals, What you are looking for is called 'flooded' coax. It's filled with a gooey gel that keeps any penetration of water to an absolute minimum. I use Davis BuryFlex but there are lots of different brands of flooded coax.
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