APE Antenna Questions


W7RIV
 

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the comments of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use, portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com


Milton Garb <w6qe@...>
 

Bryon,
I've participated in 2 APE events, as a portable station, and look forward to doing it again this coming August.
May I 1st ask how long you'll be able to operate? This will be a factor in your antenna, station, power source, etc.
Will you have a source for A/C power? The power grid?, A generator?, Batteries?
It's a real kick planning the APE, and the truth be known, that's half the fun.
Just think of APE as a Field day. You can make it as long as you want, or just the few hours necessary to make the minimum number of Q's to be an official APE operation.
Once you're set up, ready to go, and start calling "cq cq cq 070 Club APE Event de W7RIV W7RIV k" and see all the guys coming back to your call, all the work, planning and minor hassles will suddenly become worth it.
Ask more questions. This is will be a good email string for the reflector.
Milt.
W6QE - 070-650

----- Original Message -----
From: W7RIV
To: 070@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2012 11:33 PM
Subject: [070] APE Antenna Questions



Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the comments of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use, portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com


ve3oij <ve3oij@...>
 

For my APE a couple years ago, I used a Buddipole and a HyGain DP-19PD

http://www.buddipole.com/debupa.html

http://radioworld.ca/amateur-accessories-antennas-hf-antennas-wire-antennas-dp-19pd-p-3298.html

However, if you want to build your own to keep costs down, I'd recommend assembling a G5RV. The plans are widely available on the internet, and building it will quite literally take less than an hour.

For power on my APE, I have a 750W inverter for running from batteries, but mostly I use my little generator:

http://powerequipment.honda.com/products/modeldetail.aspx?page=modeldetail§ion=P2GG&modelname=EU2000i&modelid=EU2000IKN

I also have a 100' outdoor extension cord that can be handy depending on the location.

From personal experience with this, be sure you have a shelter of some kind. I drove all the way to my APE site in sunny weather, set up in the sun, sat down, clouds moved in 10 minutes later and it rained all weekend.

73 de VE3OIJ
-Darin

--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the comments of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use, portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Steve W3HF
 

Bryon -

For my APEs and other portable ops, I've used the original version of the AD5X vertical. The design was first published in QST in July 2002. Updates were published on eHam.net, and the last iteration is on Phil's web site:

http://www.ad5x.com/images/Articles/VerticalRevH.pdf

(I started building this new design a few years ago but never finished.)

Thinking back over this, I've used it on about a dozen portable operations (some APE, some not) in NC, DE, PA, CO, MA, and MI, as well as testing it a few times from home.

Steve
W3HF

--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the comments of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use, portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com




w6qe.milt <w6qe@...>
 

Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed by one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception of the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650

--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the comments of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use, portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


David Westbrook
 

I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason for
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was mostly
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But it
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon hitch.
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M & 17M
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do mobile,
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car battery).
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran coax
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so hamstick
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally pick-up-and-go, for
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

--david
KJ4IZW
070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@verizon.net> wrote:

**


Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed by
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception of
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650


--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the comments
of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use, portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com





W7RIV
 

Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on the
grid.

I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests at
the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work. I'm
a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord to
a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that. Another
reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things about a
buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy, would
I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com



On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@gmail.com>wrote:

**


I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason for
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was mostly
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But it
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon hitch.
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M & 17M
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do mobile,
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
battery).
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran coax
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so hamstick
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally pick-up-and-go, for
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

--david
KJ4IZW
070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@verizon.net> wrote:

**


Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed
by
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception
of
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650


--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you
in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
comments
of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Jerry N9AVY
 

If you're using AC power make sure that if you run more that 100 ft. you use a heavy duty extension cord (#12 AWG).  Otherwise you may have voltage drop problems.

I'll be watching for you in August.  Good luck !

Jerry  N9AVY

--- On Mon, 1/16/12, W7RIV <nnegrom@gmail.com> wrote:

From: W7RIV <nnegrom@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions
To: 070@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, January 16, 2012, 10:56 AM

Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on the
grid.

I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests at
the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work. I'm
a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord to
a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that. Another
reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things about a
buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy, would
I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com



On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@gmail.com>wrote:

**


I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason for
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was mostly
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But it
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon hitch.
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M & 17M
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do mobile,
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
battery).
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran coax
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so hamstick
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally pick-up-and-go, for
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

--david
KJ4IZW
070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@verizon.net> wrote:

**


Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed
by
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception
of
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650


--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you
in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
comments
of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities.



Yahoo! Groups Links





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Milton Garb <w6qe@...>
 

Bryon,
At this point, let me add this: Without radials, all that any Black Widow, Ham Stick or other vertical is going to do is heat up the ground under it. I'm excluding some of the commercially made verticals that have counter poises' under them, or attached to them. They're all different.
The Black Widow requires a minimum of 6 ea, 16' radials. I had the wire so I made up 6 gangs of 6 wires each and it takes about an hour to deploy the entire thing.
I won't say that any antenna is better than any other when it comes to an APE operation.
I do think you're doing this with the correct approach...to ask questions and to learn.
Milt.
W6QE

----- Original Message -----
From: "W7RIV" <nnegrom@gmail.com>
To: <070@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 8:56 AM
Subject: Re: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions


Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on the
grid.

I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests at
the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work. I'm
a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord to
a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that. Another
reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things about a
buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy, would
I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com



On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@gmail.com>wrote:

**


I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason for
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was mostly
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But it
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon hitch.
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M & 17M
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do mobile,
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
battery).
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran coax
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so hamstick
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally pick-up-and-go, for
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

--david
KJ4IZW
070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@verizon.net> wrote:

**


Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed
by
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception
of
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650


--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you
in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
comments
of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com









------------------------------------

Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities.



Yahoo! Groups Links



Ted Krempa <trkrempa@...>
 

Byron, often overlooked in these discussions is the end fed antenna or end fed Zepp. This is what I use when traveling or in the RV. They are fed at one end with coax and the other end goes up in a tree or wherever. Very compact and less hassle than a dipole and better than a vertical. You can roll 'em up and store in a 1 gallon zip lock bag. Nail 1 end to the picnic table and the other end in a tree. RadioWavze makes them and Par Electronics has designed models but someone else makes them under license. Just Google these companies.
 
GL, Ted, K7TRK

From: W7RIV <nnegrom@gmail.com>
To: 070@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 8:56 AM
Subject: Re: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions

Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on the
grid.

I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests at
the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work. I'm
a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord to
a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that. Another
reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things about a
buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy, would
I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com



On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@gmail.com>wrote:

**


I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason for
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was mostly
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But it
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon hitch.
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M & 17M
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do mobile,
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
battery).
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran coax
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so hamstick
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally pick-up-and-go, for
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

--david
KJ4IZW
070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@verizon.net> wrote:

**


Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed
by
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception
of
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650


--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you
in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
comments
of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com






 





------------------------------------

Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities.



Yahoo! Groups Links


Ted Krempa <trkrempa@...>
 

p.s. Byron, on the G5RV for portable. I would pass on that idea. People will try and tell you its an all band antenna...maybe, on a good day and ideal set-up. The optimum G5RV setup is supposed to have 35 ft of ladder line feeding the antenna. You would need to find 2 trees an ideal space apart, climb up 35 ft to hang it, then mess around with rolling up ladder line and rolls of antenna wire...just a big hassle.
 
GL, ted, K7TRK

From: Ted Krempa <trkrempa@yahoo.com>
To: "070@yahoogroups.com" <070@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions


 
Byron, often overlooked in these discussions is the end fed antenna or end fed Zepp. This is what I use when traveling or in the RV. They are fed at one end with coax and the other end goes up in a tree or wherever. Very compact and less hassle than a dipole and better than a vertical. You can roll 'em up and store in a 1 gallon zip lock bag. Nail 1 end to the picnic table and the other end in a tree. RadioWavze makes them and Par Electronics has designed models but someone else makes them under license. Just Google these companies.
 
GL, Ted, K7TRK

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Steve W3HF
 

Bryon -

Here are some generalizations. Actual performance can vary with quality of construction, installation variations (e.g., radial placements), and terrain differences. Note that antenna performance is a very volatile topic with hams, so I've put on my flame-retardant jumpsuit prior to making these comments.

Both of the verticals mentioned so far (BW and AD5X) are similar in that they are shortened (i.e., not a full quarter-wave long) and loaded (i.e., using a loading coil to adjust impedance so as to "lengthen" the antenna). This loading reduces efficiency, but that's the compromise you make for a smaller antenna. The differences are in type of construction, portability, and where the loading coil is. (The AD5X is center-loaded. I believe the BW may be base-loaded.) Both depend on ground radials. My guess is that performance will be pretty similar given similar ground radials, with a small difference depending on actual length.

The Buddipole (in its basic configuration) is a loaded dipole--again, loading coils (one in each leg) to "lengthen" a physically-short antenna. The loading will again reduce efficiency when compared with a full-size dipole. One problem with dipoles is that their performance at lower heights (less than about 1/2 wavelength) tends to favor energy directed towards the sky rather than the horizon. Verticals have more energy towards the horizon at low heights. (It all depends on whether you want DX capability or NVIS. Maybe this lack of low-angle radiation of a low Buddipole is the negative you've heard of.)

By the way, Budd also has a vertical version of the Buddipole (called the Buddistick), and my guess it would be comparable to the AD5X design.

The Hamstick is the ultimate base-loaded vertical. It's designed for minimum length and maximum durability, as it is intended for mobile use (at highway speeds) as-is. Since it's the shortest, its performance will be the worst of the verticals mentioned, regardless of installation.

Steve
W3HF

--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on the
grid.

I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests at
the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work. I'm
a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord to
a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that. Another
reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things about a
buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy, would
I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com



On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@...>wrote:

**


I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason for
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was mostly
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But it
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon hitch.
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M & 17M
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do mobile,
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
battery).
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran coax
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so hamstick
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally pick-up-and-go, for
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

--david
KJ4IZW
070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@...> wrote:

**


Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed
by
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception
of
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650


--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you
in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
comments
of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com










Lee A. Ratcliff <lratcliff@...>
 

What bands are you looking at working, how much power, and what kind of performance are you looking for? On the simple end is a 1/4 wavelength wire with an equal counterpoise, to a standard dipole for the band you want to work. If you are wanting to work several bands, I would recommend a Windom. To me, simple is better. You would be surprised what you can do with a resonate dipole.

Lee
KC4ART

-----Original Message-----
From: melachri
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 4:07 PM
To: 070@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions

Bryon -

Here are some generalizations. Actual performance can vary with quality of construction, installation variations (e.g., radial placements), and terrain differences. Note that antenna performance is a very volatile topic with hams, so I've put on my flame-retardant jumpsuit prior to making these comments.

Both of the verticals mentioned so far (BW and AD5X) are similar in that they are shortened (i.e., not a full quarter-wave long) and loaded (i.e., using a loading coil to adjust impedance so as to "lengthen" the antenna). This loading reduces efficiency, but that's the compromise you make for a smaller antenna. The differences are in type of construction, portability, and where the loading coil is. (The AD5X is center-loaded. I believe the BW may be base-loaded.) Both depend on ground radials. My guess is that performance will be pretty similar given similar ground radials, with a small difference depending on actual length.

The Buddipole (in its basic configuration) is a loaded dipole--again, loading coils (one in each leg) to "lengthen" a physically-short antenna. The loading will again reduce efficiency when compared with a full-size dipole. One problem with dipoles is that their performance at lower heights (less than about 1/2 wavelength) tends to favor energy directed towards the sky rather than the horizon. Verticals have more energy towards the horizon at low heights. (It all depends on whether you want DX capability or NVIS. Maybe this lack of low-angle radiation of a low Buddipole is the negative you've heard of.)

By the way, Budd also has a vertical version of the Buddipole (called the Buddistick), and my guess it would be comparable to the AD5X design.

The Hamstick is the ultimate base-loaded vertical. It's designed for minimum length and maximum durability, as it is intended for mobile use (at highway speeds) as-is. Since it's the shortest, its performance will be the worst of the verticals mentioned, regardless of installation.

Steve
W3HF

--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on the
grid.

I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests at
the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work. I'm
a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord to
a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that. Another
reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things about a
buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy, would
I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com



On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@...>wrote:

**


I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason for
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was mostly
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But it
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon hitch.
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M & 17M
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do mobile,
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
battery).
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran coax
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so hamstick
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally pick-up-and-go, for
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

--david
KJ4IZW
070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@...> wrote:

**


Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed
by
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception
of
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650


--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you
in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
comments
of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com









------------------------------------

Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the latest information on 070 Club activities.



Yahoo! Groups Links


W7RIV
 

I'm most familiar with 20m and 40m, I'm looking to extend my operating
bands to 80m and 160m but that doesn't necessarily mean I'll be doing that
for APE. But all this information will help me with that. 30m would be
good, but I hardly find anyone to talk with on there.

This exact moment I'm limited to 10watts, however by August I hope to have
a 100watt K3 (at least that is the plan). Performance, that is relative...I
want to make contacts. So whatever performance I need for that. <smiles>

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 2:12 PM, Lee A. Ratcliff <lratcliff@isp.com> wrote:

**


What bands are you looking at working, how much power, and what kind of
performance are you looking for? On the simple end is a 1/4 wavelength
wire
with an equal counterpoise, to a standard dipole for the band you want to
work. If you are wanting to work several bands, I would recommend a
Windom.
To me, simple is better. You would be surprised what you can do with a
resonate dipole.

Lee
KC4ART


-----Original Message-----
From: melachri
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 4:07 PM
To: 070@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions

Bryon -

Here are some generalizations. Actual performance can vary with quality of
construction, installation variations (e.g., radial placements), and
terrain
differences. Note that antenna performance is a very volatile topic with
hams, so I've put on my flame-retardant jumpsuit prior to making these
comments.

Both of the verticals mentioned so far (BW and AD5X) are similar in that
they are shortened (i.e., not a full quarter-wave long) and loaded (i.e.,
using a loading coil to adjust impedance so as to "lengthen" the antenna).
This loading reduces efficiency, but that's the compromise you make for a
smaller antenna. The differences are in type of construction, portability,
and where the loading coil is. (The AD5X is center-loaded. I believe the
BW
may be base-loaded.) Both depend on ground radials. My guess is that
performance will be pretty similar given similar ground radials, with a
small difference depending on actual length.

The Buddipole (in its basic configuration) is a loaded dipole--again,
loading coils (one in each leg) to "lengthen" a physically-short antenna.
The loading will again reduce efficiency when compared with a full-size
dipole. One problem with dipoles is that their performance at lower
heights
(less than about 1/2 wavelength) tends to favor energy directed towards
the
sky rather than the horizon. Verticals have more energy towards the
horizon
at low heights. (It all depends on whether you want DX capability or NVIS.
Maybe this lack of low-angle radiation of a low Buddipole is the negative
you've heard of.)

By the way, Budd also has a vertical version of the Buddipole (called the
Buddistick), and my guess it would be comparable to the AD5X design.

The Hamstick is the ultimate base-loaded vertical. It's designed for
minimum
length and maximum durability, as it is intended for mobile use (at
highway
speeds) as-is. Since it's the shortest, its performance will be the worst
of
the verticals mentioned, regardless of installation.

Steve
W3HF

--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on
the
grid.

I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests
at
the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work.
I'm
a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord
to
a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that.
Another
reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things
about
a
buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy,
would
I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com



On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@...>wrote:

**


I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason
for
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was
mostly
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But
it
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon
hitch.
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M &
17M
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do
mobile,
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
battery).
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran
coax
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so
hamstick
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally
pick-up-and-go,
for
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

--david
KJ4IZW
070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@...> wrote:

**


Bryon,
I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna
that
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was
designed
by
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable
op's
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's.
The
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for
fast
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the
exception
of
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
Milton
W6QE
070-650


--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the
club
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a
few
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of
you
in
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
making
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt
Lake
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
comments
of
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
portable
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.

Thanks,

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------------------


Check out the 070 Club website at <http://www.podxs070.com/> for the
latest
information on 070 Club activities.

Yahoo! Groups Links



Lee A. Ratcliff <lratcliff@...>
 

If you want to run 40m and down on the APE, a New Carolina Windom would be 66 feet long, with a vertacal section of only 10 feet. I have one here cut for 80 meters and down, up about 50 feet, and it down real well from my location. The nice thing about the Windom, it should be resonate on the band its cut for, and each harmonic band down (cut for 40, should work 20, 15, and 10 also). With a tuner, you can work pretty much all bands.

Here is a page for the windom http://www.hamuniverse.com/k4iwlnewwindom.html

If you only want to run 20m, I would look at a simple resonate dipole, with would be about 33 feet long or so. http://www.hamuniverse.com/easydipole.html

Check out your area, and see what you have as far as trees, and open space between them for stringing antennas, and then go from there.


Lee
KC4ART

From: W7RIV
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 4:21 PM
To: lratcliff@isp.com
Subject: Re: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions

Can you explain more about a Windom? I agree. Simple is good. I'm an engineer so I can handle a little more complex if it means hanging it in a tree, etc. However, I really just want to make sure I can get the antenna to make QSO's.

When you say resonant dipole...that is having something like a Off-Center Fed, or End Center Fed piece of wire built to the exact length required for the band?

I've also looked into a Double Zepp as I hear excellent things about it and I think that is similar to a Center Fed and maybe it is a center fed dipole and the length of the wire matters because it is a Double Zepp. Being so new, I'm not familiar enough with my terms at this point.

Your help has been appreciated.


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV
http://www.w7riv.com


igwt1939 <igwt1939@...>
 

Gosh so many questions and answers on antennas and I have another questions.I also have a statement.If it's not broke don't fix it.
I run just a rag tag station. I have three antennas. A Mosley tribander. A HF6V vertical (without radials) and a G5RV dipole.
I have a remote antenna switch that I built from a QST a few years ago with one coax running to the shack.
3 or 4 years ago lightening got in the shack and also did some damage to the remote antenna switch. After getting everthing going again and was trying out some new modes I noticed my Kenwood TS450 SAT tuner wouldn't tune to one of the bands. I think it was 30 meters.I remembered reading somewhere about using a certain length of coax at the antenna connect point to tune to certain bands. I was connected to the dipole at that time.
I did use a piece of coax and found that my tuner would then then tune to that band.After thinking about it for a few I wondered what would happen if I disconnected the coax tail tuner and hook the vertical instead. Bingo the tuner was happy on all the bands.Yep I like to exsperment so I then hooked up the Mosley beam. I then had a dipole,a vertical and a beam all hooked together.The antenna tuner was still happy except on the 17 meter band.If I need to work that band I just hop outside and disconnect the beam coax.
I am still making contacts everday on the digital modes but have no idea how the 3 antennas hooked together work.
Thanks for your time
KO4PU
Robert Phelps
igwt1939@att.net
PS Would appreciate any suggestions how this works

----- Original Message -----
From: melachri
To: 070@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 3:07 PM
Subject: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions



Bryon -

Here are some generalizations. Actual performance can vary with quality of construction, installation variations (e.g., radial placements), and terrain differences. Note that antenna performance is a very volatile topic with hams, so I've put on my flame-retardant jumpsuit prior to making these comments.

Both of the verticals mentioned so far (BW and AD5X) are similar in that they are shortened (i.e., not a full quarter-wave long) and loaded (i.e., using a loading coil to adjust impedance so as to "lengthen" the antenna). This loading reduces efficiency, but that's the compromise you make for a smaller antenna. The differences are in type of construction, portability, and where the loading coil is. (The AD5X is center-loaded. I believe the BW may be base-loaded.) Both depend on ground radials. My guess is that performance will be pretty similar given similar ground radials, with a small difference depending on actual length.

The Buddipole (in its basic configuration) is a loaded dipole--again, loading coils (one in each leg) to "lengthen" a physically-short antenna. The loading will again reduce efficiency when compared with a full-size dipole. One problem with dipoles is that their performance at lower heights (less than about 1/2 wavelength) tends to favor energy directed towards the sky rather than the horizon. Verticals have more energy towards the horizon at low heights. (It all depends on whether you want DX capability or NVIS. Maybe this lack of low-angle radiation of a low Buddipole is the negative you've heard of.)

By the way, Budd also has a vertical version of the Buddipole (called the Buddistick), and my guess it would be comparable to the AD5X design.

The Hamstick is the ultimate base-loaded vertical. It's designed for minimum length and maximum durability, as it is intended for mobile use (at highway speeds) as-is. Since it's the shortest, its performance will be the worst of the verticals mentioned, regardless of installation.

Steve
W3HF

--- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
> of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
> if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
> the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on the
> grid.
>
> I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests at
> the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work. I'm
> a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
> figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
> will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord to
> a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.
>
> I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that. Another
> reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
> very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things about a
> buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
> hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy, would
> I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
> Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?
>
>
> - -
> 73 de Bryon/W7RIV
> http://www.w7riv.com
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@...>wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason for
> > getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
> > I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was mostly
> > for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But it
> > was easy, cheap, and fun!
> >
> > For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon hitch.
> > ~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M & 17M
> > hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.
> >
> > For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do mobile,
> > too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
> > battery).
> > For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran coax
> > out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so hamstick
> > on car works great)
> >
> > Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally pick-up-and-go, for
> > either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
> > custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
> > writeup of that project:
> > http://dwestbrook.net/projects/ham/go-box-ic706/
> > Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
> > The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.
> >
> > --david
> > KJ4IZW
> > 070 #1041
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@...> wrote:
> >
> > > **
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Bryon,
> > > I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna that
> > > I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
> > > use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was designed
> > by
> > > one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable op's
> > > than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's. The
> > > antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for fast
> > > put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the exception
> > of
> > > the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
> > > It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.
> > > Milton
> > > W6QE
> > > 070-650
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In 070@yahoogroups.com, W7RIV <nnegrom@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the club
> > > > through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a few
> > > > people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of you
> > in
> > > > the PSKFest.,
> > > >
> > > > I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
> > > making
> > > > plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt Lake
> > > > City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
> > comments
> > > of
> > > > the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
> > portable
> > > > and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >
> > > > - -
> > > > 73 de Bryon/W7RIV
> > > > http://www.w7riv.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>


Phil Barnett <philb@...>
 

On Mon, 2012-01-16 at 09:56 -0700, W7RIV wrote:

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that.

I have a Cushcraft R8 here are my go to antenna. Unless you are going to
put up a tower and a beam with a rotor you'll have a hard time beating
this antenna.

It's a half wave vertical, so you can't improve it by adding radials.