Date   

Re: Hustler 6BTV

K8TOM
 

Larry,

Oh, I actually am somewhat familiar with the territory, having worked in the Tri-Cities and surrounding areas for a couple years.  It is quite a different situation compared to our sogginess.

It was interesting that the thing that while there the thing that I most missed most was just the presence of mountains/hills surrounding.  I grew up in the Applachian Smokies, so I've been a "hills" boy all my life I guess.  

Washington is a really interesting state in terms of the variety of climate zones that we have.  Everything from genuine rain forests to real deserts, they say.

It is great to hear from you!

73,

Tom
K8TOM
815

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On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Larry Rockne #404 <pops4355@...> wrote:
Tom,

You should vist the 'other' Washinton, the S.E. portion of the State. Its the desert of the Evergreen State.

In August the average high is 91 degrees, record high 106 degrees.
The average rainfall in August is 0.37 inches.

Not to many pine trees though, lots of tumble weeds and sagebrush.

73,
Larry WA7HDZ #404.



Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Brian (N2MLP)
 

Guess I was going in right direction making my long wire 560 feet long  

About 65 feet in air at lowest points

 

From: 070Club@groups.io [mailto:070Club@groups.io] On Behalf Of Matthew King - AK4MK
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 3:49 PM
To: 070Club@groups.io
Subject: Re: [070Club] East, West, and in between on 160m

 

Hmmm.... at 30ft, that antenna is about 0.07~ above the ground on 160m. That's the equivalent of a 20m dipole about FOUR FEET off the ground. I think we all have an idea of how well that'd work for anything other than very close-in communications.

 

An end-fed antenna really likes to be right at 1/2~ long at the lowest frequency of interest, so that'd be about 255' on 160. A true "long wire" antenna is a full wavelength or longer at the lowest frequency of interest, or just over 500 feet.

 

As Carr says  in the Practical Antenna Handbook regarding an end-fed antenna (an inherently unbalanced antenna), " ...the user must realize the most important thing he or she can do to improve the antenna is to make sure there is an excellent RF ground system attached to the chassis of the ATU (tuner) or transmitter where the wire connects."  The emphasis is mine, and is meant to indicate that a piece of #6 wire to an 8 foot ground rod isn't an effective RF ground. That's a safety ground. An effective RF ground is a counterpoise or radial field. 

 

Right now, with no counterpoise, your feedline is being forced to be the counterpoise, or at least it would be without the isolator on it. I'm of the opinion that you're much better off WITH the isolator so that you're not bringing RF into the shack on the feedline, but I'm also of the opinion that you NEED a counterpoise, especially with the isolator on the feedline. No matter how productive the antenna may have been to this point, an effective counterpoise would make it much more so, especially on 160 where it's already very low and very short.  There's not going to be a whole lot of efficiency there either way, but the counterpoise should help quite a bit.

 

In effect, you have three things you can do to improve your antenna:

 

Get it higher

Make it longer

Give it an effective counterpoise system

 

Several radials (8-16) just as long as you can make them and fanned out equally (as obstacles allow) hooked to the ground post on your matchbox should make a real difference in the performance of your antenna on all bands. More radials are better, if you can do it, up to a point of diminishing returns of about 40 radials. If the isolator is currently at the feedpoint, you could move it to the shack entry point instead and that'd make your feedline radiate and be a very minimalist counterpoise. It may well bring common mode current close enough to your shack to make weird things happen to speakers, computers, monitors, TV's, etc... as well, though.  If absolutely NOTHING else can be done, at least do a short piece of #6 wire to a fully driven ground rod with a well-biting clamp on it.  That might make some difference, but nothing approaching that of a real counterpoise.  

 

Good luck with it, friend Jim - I'll be out spreading more radials myself in the spring!

 

73

 

Matt

AK4MK

 

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 2:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:

No counter poise.  Am using the 88 foot QSO-King by NU0R.  It's up about 30 foot. Has a line isolator in the feed coax.

 

Jim

 

On 2/1/2018 12:34 PM, Matthew King - AK4MK wrote:

Hey, Jim - what sort of counterpoise are you using on your end-fed wire?  How high is it? How long is it?

 

Inquiring minds wanna know more!

 

73

 

Matt

AK4MK

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 1:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:

Using an end-fed wire. Oriented kind of NW-SE. And running about 50 watts.  Crank it up to 80 watts at times on this band, but any higher start getting ALC.  SWR is about 1.4 on the wire.

My contact the other evening was with KX4WB who is in TN, so think I am getting out East.

Have a Gap Titan DX vertical, but it doesn't want to load on 160, even using an external tuner instead of the rigs internal tuner.

On the top band, I am starting to feel like Barry does on all bands.  hihi

Jim K5SP


On 2/1/2018 8:10 AM, Rick - N7WE wrote:

Jim-

You may have said earlier and I missed it, but what are you using for an antenna on 160?  If it is a wire, how is it oriented?  How much power are you using?

Rick - N7WE


On 2/1/2018 08:34, Jim K5SP wrote:


And I am curious about it also. The other evening I could see 4-5 stations, with great copy on KX4WB and some copy on the others.  But the only one that I could QSO with was KX4WB, nobody else would respond. It seems that in my location, since I can see/hear some of the east coast stations, I should also be able to see Barry, but no luck there.

Can we get some midwest stations on?

Jim K5SP






--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director


 

 


--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director

 


Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Matthew King - AK4MK
 

Hmmm.... at 30ft, that antenna is about 0.07~ above the ground on 160m. That's the equivalent of a 20m dipole about FOUR FEET off the ground. I think we all have an idea of how well that'd work for anything other than very close-in communications.

An end-fed antenna really likes to be right at 1/2~ long at the lowest frequency of interest, so that'd be about 255' on 160. A true "long wire" antenna is a full wavelength or longer at the lowest frequency of interest, or just over 500 feet.

As Carr says  in the Practical Antenna Handbook regarding an end-fed antenna (an inherently unbalanced antenna), " ...the user must realize the most important thing he or she can do to improve the antenna is to make sure there is an excellent RF ground system attached to the chassis of the ATU (tuner) or transmitter where the wire connects."  The emphasis is mine, and is meant to indicate that a piece of #6 wire to an 8 foot ground rod isn't an effective RF ground. That's a safety ground. An effective RF ground is a counterpoise or radial field. 

Right now, with no counterpoise, your feedline is being forced to be the counterpoise, or at least it would be without the isolator on it. I'm of the opinion that you're much better off WITH the isolator so that you're not bringing RF into the shack on the feedline, but I'm also of the opinion that you NEED a counterpoise, especially with the isolator on the feedline. No matter how productive the antenna may have been to this point, an effective counterpoise would make it much more so, especially on 160 where it's already very low and very short.  There's not going to be a whole lot of efficiency there either way, but the counterpoise should help quite a bit.

In effect, you have three things you can do to improve your antenna:

Get it higher
Make it longer
Give it an effective counterpoise system

Several radials (8-16) just as long as you can make them and fanned out equally (as obstacles allow) hooked to the ground post on your matchbox should make a real difference in the performance of your antenna on all bands. More radials are better, if you can do it, up to a point of diminishing returns of about 40 radials. If the isolator is currently at the feedpoint, you could move it to the shack entry point instead and that'd make your feedline radiate and be a very minimalist counterpoise. It may well bring common mode current close enough to your shack to make weird things happen to speakers, computers, monitors, TV's, etc... as well, though.  If absolutely NOTHING else can be done, at least do a short piece of #6 wire to a fully driven ground rod with a well-biting clamp on it.  That might make some difference, but nothing approaching that of a real counterpoise.  

Good luck with it, friend Jim - I'll be out spreading more radials myself in the spring!

73

Matt
AK4MK

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 2:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:

No counter poise.  Am using the 88 foot QSO-King by NU0R.  It's up about 30 foot. Has a line isolator in the feed coax.


Jim


On 2/1/2018 12:34 PM, Matthew King - AK4MK wrote:
Hey, Jim - what sort of counterpoise are you using on your end-fed wire?  How high is it? How long is it?

Inquiring minds wanna know more!

73

Matt
AK4MK

Virus-free. www.avast.com

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 1:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:
Using an end-fed wire. Oriented kind of NW-SE. And running about 50 watts.  Crank it up to 80 watts at times on this band, but any higher start getting ALC.  SWR is about 1.4 on the wire.

My contact the other evening was with KX4WB who is in TN, so think I am getting out East.

Have a Gap Titan DX vertical, but it doesn't want to load on 160, even using an external tuner instead of the rigs internal tuner.

On the top band, I am starting to feel like Barry does on all bands.  hihi

Jim K5SP


On 2/1/2018 8:10 AM, Rick - N7WE wrote:
Jim-

You may have said earlier and I missed it, but what are you using for an antenna on 160?  If it is a wire, how is it oriented?  How much power are you using?

Rick - N7WE


On 2/1/2018 08:34, Jim K5SP wrote:

And I am curious about it also. The other evening I could see 4-5 stations, with great copy on KX4WB and some copy on the others.  But the only one that I could QSO with was KX4WB, nobody else would respond. It seems that in my location, since I can see/hear some of the east coast stations, I should also be able to see Barry, but no luck there.

Can we get some midwest stations on?

Jim K5SP








--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director






--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director



Re: Hustler 6BTV

Larry Rockne #404
 

Tom,

You should vist the 'other' Washinton, the S.E. portion of the State. Its the desert of the Evergreen State.

In August the average high is 91 degrees, record high 106 degrees.
The average rainfall in August is 0.37 inches.

Not to many pine trees though, lots of tumble weeds and sagebrush.

73,
Larry WA7HDZ #404.


Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Mike Besemer - WM4B #348 <mwbesemer@...>
 

Yep.   I see it not only on 160, but pretty much on all the bands.  Old Sol must be playing tricks with us.

Mike
WM4B

On Feb 1, 2018 12:08 PM, Richard Rohrer <kc3ef1@gmail.com> wrote:

Like Rick, I find the propagation better N/S than E/W.  Worked N2MLP in PA last night.  Saw a couple of faint traces, but could not get any decode from them.  Only heard a couple of CW signals and no SSB last night.

73
Dick - KC3EF
-----Original Message-----
From: 070Club@groups.io [mailto:070Club@groups.io] On Behalf Of B C
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 10:59 AM
To: 070Club@groups.io
Subject: Re: [070Club] East, West, and in between on 160m

I would like to hear how you are top loading that vertical for 160M...I am using a Cushcraft AP8A..and can almost get it to tune on 160..well, get the swr down to 2:1 anyway..but who knows what the R and X are..It could be a worm warmer on that band.
Brian K9WIS

---- Rick - N7WE <n7we1980@gmail.com> wrote:
Can someone help me understand what is going on with 160m and the group?  Seems like up and down the east coast we can make contacts.  Jim - K5SP - just north of Dallas Texas isn't having much luck and neither is Barry - VA7GEM - in North Vacouver BC.  I've worked John - KE4JB in NY - 1055 miles from my QTH, but haven't seen Jim - 963 miles from me.  I can understand not seeing Barry - that is 2587 miles.

So what is it?  Differences in the number of people on the band in
different areas?  Is prop different N/S and E/W on 160?  Just differences in antennas?  Radiation patterns?  Differences in Tx power?  Maybe time of day?  The band does open and close based on sunset and sunrise.  I'm stumped.

The next time I rig the 6BTV for 160m I'm going to rotate the
direction of the wire I use to top load it 90% and see if that makes a difference.  If I better understood how to use EZNEC maybe I could model the radiation pattern, but that is way beyond me.  I can do a simple dipole model, but when you get to trapped vertical with ground radials, with capacitive top loading, I'm completely over my head.

All opinions and thought are welcome.
--
*Rick - N7WE*
*070 - #1602*






Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

William B
 

I am using an inverted L on 160. Yesterday was my anniversary so I didn't get to make any contacts.  I will be around this evening, (I hope) if anybody else needs 160 meter contacts.

William
KX4WB


On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 1:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:

No counter poise.  Am using the 88 foot QSO-King by NU0R.  It's up about 30 foot. Has a line isolator in the feed coax.


Jim


On 2/1/2018 12:34 PM, Matthew King - AK4MK wrote:
Hey, Jim - what sort of counterpoise are you using on your end-fed wire?  How high is it? How long is it?

Inquiring minds wanna know more!

73

Matt
AK4MK

Virus-free. www.avast.com

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 1:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:
Using an end-fed wire. Oriented kind of NW-SE. And running about 50 watts.  Crank it up to 80 watts at times on this band, but any higher start getting ALC.  SWR is about 1.4 on the wire.

My contact the other evening was with KX4WB who is in TN, so think I am getting out East.

Have a Gap Titan DX vertical, but it doesn't want to load on 160, even using an external tuner instead of the rigs internal tuner.

On the top band, I am starting to feel like Barry does on all bands.  hihi

Jim K5SP


On 2/1/2018 8:10 AM, Rick - N7WE wrote:
Jim-

You may have said earlier and I missed it, but what are you using for an antenna on 160?  If it is a wire, how is it oriented?  How much power are you using?

Rick - N7WE


On 2/1/2018 08:34, Jim K5SP wrote:

And I am curious about it also. The other evening I could see 4-5 stations, with great copy on KX4WB and some copy on the others.  But the only one that I could QSO with was KX4WB, nobody else would respond. It seems that in my location, since I can see/hear some of the east coast stations, I should also be able to see Barry, but no luck there.

Can we get some midwest stations on?

Jim K5SP








--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director






--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director



Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Jim K5SP
 

No counter poise.  Am using the 88 foot QSO-King by NU0R.  It's up about 30 foot. Has a line isolator in the feed coax.


Jim


On 2/1/2018 12:34 PM, Matthew King - AK4MK wrote:
Hey, Jim - what sort of counterpoise are you using on your end-fed wire?  How high is it? How long is it?

Inquiring minds wanna know more!

73

Matt
AK4MK

Virus-free. www.avast.com

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 1:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:
Using an end-fed wire. Oriented kind of NW-SE. And running about 50 watts.  Crank it up to 80 watts at times on this band, but any higher start getting ALC.  SWR is about 1.4 on the wire.

My contact the other evening was with KX4WB who is in TN, so think I am getting out East.

Have a Gap Titan DX vertical, but it doesn't want to load on 160, even using an external tuner instead of the rigs internal tuner.

On the top band, I am starting to feel like Barry does on all bands.  hihi

Jim K5SP


On 2/1/2018 8:10 AM, Rick - N7WE wrote:
Jim-

You may have said earlier and I missed it, but what are you using for an antenna on 160?  If it is a wire, how is it oriented?  How much power are you using?

Rick - N7WE


On 2/1/2018 08:34, Jim K5SP wrote:

And I am curious about it also. The other evening I could see 4-5 stations, with great copy on KX4WB and some copy on the others.  But the only one that I could QSO with was KX4WB, nobody else would respond. It seems that in my location, since I can see/hear some of the east coast stations, I should also be able to see Barry, but no luck there.

Can we get some midwest stations on?

Jim K5SP








--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director






--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director


Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Matthew King - AK4MK
 

I decided to look in my logbook to see how long it's been since Barry and I worked. It's a 2265mi trip from Hamilton, GA to North Vancouver, BC.

I got him twice last year on 20m with his VB7150 call. 

We didn't work in 2016.

In 2015, we worked on 20m and 12m. 

In 2014, we worked on 10m, 15m, 17m, 20m, and 30m.

My, how times have changed!  Hopefully we'll start swinging upward on the sunspot cycle in just a couple years so that things can improve.

Hang in there, Barry!

73

Matt
AK4MK
Inline image 1Inline image 2

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 1:40 PM, Joseph Molon <ljl2002@...> wrote:
Dick,


I observed, over the past 8 months or so, that generally N/S is working much better than E/W from here on the east side.  Used to be a slam dunk to the Euros.  All you had to decide is to whom to talk to.  Now it is much more scarce here and probably near impossible for mid and west side.  It is the same if you are trying to work stations in W6 or 7 land from here.  Barry and I made real efforts this year to link up without success.  After June I never even saw his signal when I know he was on because I saw all the stations that were talking with him. Low solar numbers are just not getting it done. There has been a slight improvement over the last month but it is nowhere near what it used to be.  I'm hoping that the ionosphere gods will again orient the electrons in a E/W pattern before we hit the bottom of this cycle.


Joe
KA1PPV  #1482


On Thu, Feb 01, 2018 at 12:08 PM, Richard Rohrer wrote:

Like Rick, I find the propagation better N/S than E/W.  Worked N2MLP in PA last night.  Saw a couple of faint traces, but could not get any decode from them.  Only heard a couple of CW signals and no SSB last night.
73 Dick - KC3EF
-----Original Message-----
From: 070Club@groups.io [mailto:070Club@groups.io] On Behalf Of B C
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 10:59 AM
To: 070Club@groups.io
Subject: Re: [070Club] East, West, and in between on 160m

I would like to hear how you are top loading that vertical for 160M...I am using a Cushcraft AP8A..and can almost get it to tune on 160..well, get the swr down to 2:1 anyway..but who knows what the R and X are..It could be a worm warmer on that band.
Brian K9WIS

---- Rick - N7WE  wrote:
Can someone help me understand what is going on with 160m and the group?  Seems like up and down the east coast we can make contacts. Jim - K5SP - just north of Dallas Texas isn't having much luck and neither is Barry - VA7GEM - in North Vacouver BC.  I've worked John - KE4JB in NY - 1055 miles from my QTH, but haven't seen Jim - 963 miles from me.  I can understand not seeing Barry - that is 2587 miles.

So what is it?  Differences in the number of people on the band in different areas?  Is prop different N/S and E/W on 160?  Just differences in antennas?  Radiation patterns?  Differences in Tx power?  Maybe time of day?  The band does open and close based on sunset and sunrise.  I'm stumped.

The next time I rig the 6BTV for 160m I'm going to rotate the direction of the wire I use to top load it 90% and see if that makes a difference.  If I better understood how to use EZNEC maybe I could model the radiation pattern, but that is way beyond me.  I can do a simple dipole model, but when you get to trapped vertical with ground radials, with capacitive top loading, I'm completely over my head.

All opinions and thought are welcome.
--
*Rick - N7WE*
*070 - #1602*













Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Joseph Molon <ljl2002@...>
 

Dick,


I observed, over the past 8 months or so, that generally N/S is working much better than E/W from here on the east side.  Used to be a slam dunk to the Euros.  All you had to decide is to whom to talk to.  Now it is much more scarce here and probably near impossible for mid and west side.  It is the same if you are trying to work stations in W6 or 7 land from here.  Barry and I made real efforts this year to link up without success.  After June I never even saw his signal when I know he was on because I saw all the stations that were talking with him. Low solar numbers are just not getting it done. There has been a slight improvement over the last month but it is nowhere near what it used to be.  I'm hoping that the ionosphere gods will again orient the electrons in a E/W pattern before we hit the bottom of this cycle.


Joe
KA1PPV  #1482

On Thu, Feb 01, 2018 at 12:08 PM, Richard Rohrer wrote:

Like Rick, I find the propagation better N/S than E/W. Worked N2MLP in PA last night. Saw a couple of faint traces, but could not get any decode from them. Only heard a couple of CW signals and no SSB last night.
73 Dick - KC3EF
-----Original Message-----
From: 070Club@groups.io [mailto:070Club@groups.io] On Behalf Of B C
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 10:59 AM
To: 070Club@groups.io
Subject: Re: [070Club] East, West, and in between on 160m

I would like to hear how you are top loading that vertical for 160M...I am using a Cushcraft AP8A..and can almost get it to tune on 160..well, get the swr down to 2:1 anyway..but who knows what the R and X are..It could be a worm warmer on that band.
Brian K9WIS

---- Rick - N7WE wrote:
Can someone help me understand what is going on with 160m and the group? Seems like up and down the east coast we can make contacts. Jim - K5SP - just north of Dallas Texas isn't having much luck and neither is Barry - VA7GEM - in North Vacouver BC. I've worked John - KE4JB in NY - 1055 miles from my QTH, but haven't seen Jim - 963 miles from me. I can understand not seeing Barry - that is 2587 miles.

So what is it? Differences in the number of people on the band in different areas? Is prop different N/S and E/W on 160? Just differences in antennas? Radiation patterns? Differences in Tx power? Maybe time of day? The band does open and close based on sunset and sunrise. I'm stumped.

The next time I rig the 6BTV for 160m I'm going to rotate the direction of the wire I use to top load it 90% and see if that makes a difference. If I better understood how to use EZNEC maybe I could model the radiation pattern, but that is way beyond me. I can do a simple dipole model, but when you get to trapped vertical with ground radials, with capacitive top loading, I'm completely over my head.

All opinions and thought are welcome.
--
*Rick - N7WE*
*070 - #1602*






Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

JEFF WALSH
 

Hello all ..... I am using a homebrew fan dipole 5 bander 10m,15/40m,20m,40m and 80m. It is center fed at 25' with a coax choke running South to North. I also have a dedicated full length 160m dipole also running South to North. Now the kicker is that I can load all bands including 160m on my multi-band fan dipole at 1.2 to 1. or better using a MFJ 993B auto tuner. On the dedicated 160m dipole I really have a hard time getting it down to a acceptable match. I figure that is because of it is also up at abt 25' and too close to the ground. 

My father{SK} was a ham for about 70 years and always said you can get a good match but the real question how efficient is the antenna ?

That's the setup here but I am lucky and live in the country on 10 acres with no restrictions of any kind. I previously lived in zero tolorance deed restricted subdivision in FL. I have a lot sympathy for those that live under such conditions having been there myself.

The above information comes from technically challanged ham.

JEFF WALSH
W3WMU
#1673
BUBBAWOOD
WORLDWIDE HEADQUARTERS
STURGIS, MS.


On Thursday, February 1, 2018 12:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:


Using an end-fed wire. Oriented kind of NW-SE. And running about 50
watts.  Crank it up to 80 watts at times on this band, but any higher
start getting ALC.  SWR is about 1.4 on the wire.

My contact the other evening was with KX4WB who is in TN, so think I am
getting out East.

Have a Gap Titan DX vertical, but it doesn't want to load on 160, even
using an external tuner instead of the rigs internal tuner.

On the top band, I am starting to feel like Barry does on all bands.  hihi

Jim K5SP


On 2/1/2018 8:10 AM, Rick - N7WE wrote:
> Jim-
>
> You may have said earlier and I missed it, but what are you using for
> an antenna on 160?  If it is a wire, how is it oriented?  How much
> power are you using?
>
> Rick - N7WE
>
>
> On 2/1/2018 08:34, Jim K5SP wrote:
>>
>> And I am curious about it also. The other evening I could see 4-5
>> stations, with great copy on KX4WB and some copy on the others.  But
>> the only one that I could QSO with was KX4WB, nobody else would
>> respond. It seems that in my location, since I can see/hear some of
>> the east coast stations, I should also be able to see Barry, but no
>> luck there.
>>
>> Can we get some midwest stations on?
>>
>> Jim K5SP
>>
>>
>
>
>



--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director






Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Matthew King - AK4MK
 

Hey, Jim - what sort of counterpoise are you using on your end-fed wire?  How high is it? How long is it?

Inquiring minds wanna know more!

73

Matt
AK4MK

Virus-free. www.avast.com

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 1:11 PM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:
Using an end-fed wire. Oriented kind of NW-SE. And running about 50 watts.  Crank it up to 80 watts at times on this band, but any higher start getting ALC.  SWR is about 1.4 on the wire.

My contact the other evening was with KX4WB who is in TN, so think I am getting out East.

Have a Gap Titan DX vertical, but it doesn't want to load on 160, even using an external tuner instead of the rigs internal tuner.

On the top band, I am starting to feel like Barry does on all bands.  hihi

Jim K5SP


On 2/1/2018 8:10 AM, Rick - N7WE wrote:
Jim-

You may have said earlier and I missed it, but what are you using for an antenna on 160?  If it is a wire, how is it oriented?  How much power are you using?

Rick - N7WE


On 2/1/2018 08:34, Jim K5SP wrote:

And I am curious about it also. The other evening I could see 4-5 stations, with great copy on KX4WB and some copy on the others.  But the only one that I could QSO with was KX4WB, nobody else would respond. It seems that in my location, since I can see/hear some of the east coast stations, I should also be able to see Barry, but no luck there.

Can we get some midwest stations on?

Jim K5SP








--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director





Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Arthur Peters
 

I've been watching this with some interest, as I have the "Top Band disease" and conclude  a number of things:

1) 160 is not fair, propagation can be one way (I hear you, you do not hear me...)
2) Grayline is really fun and unpredictable....
3) Antenna's are important and can be impacted by environment (what's around) to a greater distance than higher frequency bands
4) Rig can make a big difference, I used the same antenna, same QTH with my iCom746 Pro and my Elecraft KX3, I heard way more on the Elecraft than the iCom
the next year I traded my iCom for an Elecraft K3s and noticed a similar, though not quite as stark an improvement for the K3s over the KX3.

Lots of variables, part of the fun of amateur radio operations (and 160 in particular)



73 es God Bless,

Art / K0ACP

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 10:39 AM, Jerry N9AVY <n9avy@...> wrote:
Think it might be a combination of all those factors plus a bit of "luck".

Had a bit of luck with my 160m Alpha-Delta DX-A homebrew dual sloper on 160 and managed to work a station in Iowa running 5 watts in July one year, but then I replaced it with a "real"  DX-A  and things were never the same' in that I couldn't load up on 160m . With temp currently at 16 F  it now looks like a Spring/Summer project.

I'd suggest y'all keep trying 160 because I suspect some days on that band are hotter than others.

Jerry n9avy




From: Rick - N7WE <n7we1980@...>
To: 070Club@groups.io
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: [070Club] East, West, and in between on 160m

Jerry-
No worry Jerry, I think you qualify as "wise," but you've got to be from a long line of native born in Florida to be a "cracker" - hi hi.  Google "florida cracker."
If I'm understanding right, Jim can hear but can't be heard.  Barry can't hear.  The beverage would certainly help with hearing, but how do you deal with not being heard?  When I was using the inverted L, I could hear a bunch but no one could hear me.  The top loaded vertical solved the problem.  So was that a difference in radiation pattern, just antenna efficiency, or what?  Sure would like to help Jim, Barry and others get some 160 contacts before the season ends.
Rick - N7WE

On 2/1/2018 09:29, Jerry N9AVY wrote:
Rick:

Not trying to be a wise cracker, but I think the answer to all your questions is YES.




--
Rick - N7WE
070 - #1602




Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Jim K5SP
 

Using an end-fed wire. Oriented kind of NW-SE. And running about 50 watts.  Crank it up to 80 watts at times on this band, but any higher start getting ALC.  SWR is about 1.4 on the wire.

My contact the other evening was with KX4WB who is in TN, so think I am getting out East.

Have a Gap Titan DX vertical, but it doesn't want to load on 160, even using an external tuner instead of the rigs internal tuner.

On the top band, I am starting to feel like Barry does on all bands.  hihi

Jim K5SP

On 2/1/2018 8:10 AM, Rick - N7WE wrote:
Jim-

You may have said earlier and I missed it, but what are you using for an antenna on 160?  If it is a wire, how is it oriented?  How much power are you using?

Rick - N7WE


On 2/1/2018 08:34, Jim K5SP wrote:

And I am curious about it also. The other evening I could see 4-5 stations, with great copy on KX4WB and some copy on the others.  But the only one that I could QSO with was KX4WB, nobody else would respond. It seems that in my location, since I can see/hear some of the east coast stations, I should also be able to see Barry, but no luck there.

Can we get some midwest stations on?

Jim K5SP


--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director


Re: Hustler 6BTV

K8TOM
 

Dan,

I have heard (and personally observed) what we consider to be a bit of a defense against excessive in-migration, particularly from California and south.

Folks who move to Western WA from those areas often last about two winters and that's all they can take.  It's not the cold, since we don't too often get freezing temps; it's the constant cloud cover (daytime light level) and the much shorter daylight periods that seems to be the grief.  Why it did not bother me as a born and raised East Tennessean is a mystery, but it didn't.  Maybe I was young enough, at 21, when I landed here to adjust.

My younger adult son worked in Japan for a year and said that the main thing that he MISSED was the clouds and rain.  He said being back in the rain and clouds made him feel more "safe and secure", HI HI.

73,

Tom
K8TOM
815


On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 4:52 AM, Jim K5SP <jinnis@...> wrote:

Dan, I was stationed on Whidbey Island back in 67-69, when there was a Naval Communications Station there.� Spent about 3 months in relay center on the old seaplane base, and the rest of my time as supervisor at the transmitter site called Rocky Point.

Experienced the same thing you did, was not prepared for the strange weather they have up there.� Great salmon fishing though!

Jim, KI5SP


On 1/31/2018 8:46 PM, Dan Morris wrote:
I lived in Bremerton , WA for two years while in the military back from 72-74 going to school at Olympic College. �I was told about the weather but did not believe anyone. �Well, Got there in Aug of 72 and from about the end of Sept till sometime in DEC the sun did not shine at all and very rainy. �But people around there were used to it and when they made plans they were prepared. �Fortunately, the following year was quite a bit different except for the rain. �I did have a great time there though. �Even went up to Port Angeles �and went shrimping with a friend of ours.

Dan Morris �KZ3T





On Jan 31, 2018, at 7:14 PM, K8TOM <tsingle@...> wrote:

Dick,

Ah, visiting the Pacific NW in August.� �It's a great time to visit, as it's the least likely time for us to have significant rainfall.�

Unless I plan an outdoor adventure, that is.� A while back I did a 10 day (pedal) bike camping trip through Western WA and BC in August.� Seven days of rain, as I remember.� So, as they say, Your Mileage May Vary.

73,�
Tom�
K8TOM
815



--
Jim,  K5SP #483
Member Services Director



Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Randy True
 

I'm using a simple 160M dipole at about 25" an I have had good luck on 160. But again, most contacts have been East coast lataly.


Randy W4RTT




From: 070Club@groups.io <070Club@groups.io> on behalf of Jerry N9AVY <n9avy@...>
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 10:39 AM
To: 070Club@groups.io
Subject: Re: [070Club] East, West, and in between on 160m
 
Think it might be a combination of all those factors plus a bit of "luck".

Had a bit of luck with my 160m Alpha-Delta DX-A homebrew dual sloper on 160 and managed to work a station in Iowa running 5 watts in July one year, but then I replaced it with a "real"  DX-A  and things were never the same' in that I couldn't load up on 160m . With temp currently at 16 F  it now looks like a Spring/Summer project.

I'd suggest y'all keep trying 160 because I suspect some days on that band are hotter than others.

Jerry n9avy




From: Rick - N7WE <n7we1980@...>
To: 070Club@groups.io
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: [070Club] East, West, and in between on 160m

Jerry-
No worry Jerry, I think you qualify as "wise," but you've got to be from a long line of native born in Florida to be a "cracker" - hi hi.  Google "florida cracker."
If I'm understanding right, Jim can hear but can't be heard.  Barry can't hear.  The beverage would certainly help with hearing, but how do you deal with not being heard?  When I was using the inverted L, I could hear a bunch but no one could hear me.  The top loaded vertical solved the problem.  So was that a difference in radiation pattern, just antenna efficiency, or what?  Sure would like to help Jim, Barry and others get some 160 contacts before the season ends.
Rick - N7WE

On 2/1/2018 09:29, Jerry N9AVY wrote:
Rick:

Not trying to be a wise cracker, but I think the answer to all your questions is YES.




--
Rick - N7WE
070 - #1602



Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Matthew King - AK4MK
 

Rick - that's a bit of surprising news with your inverted L, as verticals dominate on top band from what I hear. For transmitting I mean... the beverages and other "different" antennas are supposed to be the key to hearing well on 160. I can't do a beverage as I don't have several hundred feet to run wires off the ground, so an active antenna or mag-loop will probably be my receiving solution when I put up my inverted L later this year (hopefully!)

What configuration was it?  

How high did it go before the wire turned horizontal?

How many radials did you have?

I understand that the radial field under an inverted L is more important than on a trapped vertical, and I can tell you from personal experience that it is VERY important on a trapped vertical!

Inquiring minds wanna know....

73

Matt
AK4MK

Virus-free. www.avast.com

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 9:51 AM, Rick - N7WE <n7we1980@...> wrote:

Jerry-

No worry Jerry, I think you qualify as "wise," but you've got to be from a long line of native born in Florida to be a "cracker" - hi hi.  Google "florida cracker."

If I'm understanding right, Jim can hear but can't be heard.  Barry can't hear.  The beverage would certainly help with hearing, but how do you deal with not being heard?  When I was using the inverted L, I could hear a bunch but no one could hear me.  The top loaded vertical solved the problem.  So was that a difference in radiation pattern, just antenna efficiency, or what?  Sure would like to help Jim, Barry and others get some 160 contacts before the season ends.

Rick - N7WE


On 2/1/2018 09:29, Jerry N9AVY wrote:
Rick:

Not trying to be a wise cracker, but I think the answer to all your questions is YES.




--
Rick - N7WE
070 - #1602



Re: East, West, and in between on 160m

Richard Rohrer
 

Like Rick, I find the propagation better N/S than E/W. Worked N2MLP in PA last night. Saw a couple of faint traces, but could not get any decode from them. Only heard a couple of CW signals and no SSB last night.

73
Dick - KC3EF

-----Original Message-----
From: 070Club@groups.io [mailto:070Club@groups.io] On Behalf Of B C
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 10:59 AM
To: 070Club@groups.io
Subject: Re: [070Club] East, West, and in between on 160m

I would like to hear how you are top loading that vertical for 160M...I am using a Cushcraft AP8A..and can almost get it to tune on 160..well, get the swr down to 2:1 anyway..but who knows what the R and X are..It could be a worm warmer on that band.
Brian K9WIS

---- Rick - N7WE <n7we1980@gmail.com> wrote:
Can someone help me understand what is going on with 160m and the group? Seems like up and down the east coast we can make contacts. Jim - K5SP - just north of Dallas Texas isn't having much luck and neither is Barry - VA7GEM - in North Vacouver BC. I've worked John - KE4JB in NY - 1055 miles from my QTH, but haven't seen Jim - 963 miles from me. I can understand not seeing Barry - that is 2587 miles.

So what is it? Differences in the number of people on the band in
different areas? Is prop different N/S and E/W on 160? Just differences in antennas? Radiation patterns? Differences in Tx power? Maybe time of day? The band does open and close based on sunset and sunrise. I'm stumped.

The next time I rig the 6BTV for 160m I'm going to rotate the
direction of the wire I use to top load it 90% and see if that makes a difference. If I better understood how to use EZNEC maybe I could model the radiation pattern, but that is way beyond me. I can do a simple dipole model, but when you get to trapped vertical with ground radials, with capacitive top loading, I'm completely over my head.

All opinions and thought are welcome.
--
*Rick - N7WE*
*070 - #1602*


Limited space antenna for 160m

Jerry N9AVY
 

And this on antennas on small lots..

audiosystemsgroup.com/160MPacificon.pdf


A bit more on 160m

Jerry N9AVY
 


160m propagation chart

Jerry N9AVY
 

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