Re: APE Antenna Questions


I'm most familiar with 20m and 40m, I'm looking to extend my operating
bands to 80m and 160m but that doesn't necessarily mean I'll be doing that
for APE. But all this information will help me with that. 30m would be
good, but I hardly find anyone to talk with on there.

This exact moment I'm limited to 10watts, however by August I hope to have
a 100watt K3 (at least that is the plan). Performance, that is relative...I
want to make contacts. So whatever performance I need for that. <smiles>

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 2:12 PM, Lee A. Ratcliff <> wrote:


What bands are you looking at working, how much power, and what kind of
performance are you looking for? On the simple end is a 1/4 wavelength
with an equal counterpoise, to a standard dipole for the band you want to
work. If you are wanting to work several bands, I would recommend a
To me, simple is better. You would be surprised what you can do with a
resonate dipole.


-----Original Message-----
From: melachri
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 4:07 PM
Subject: [070] Re: APE Antenna Questions

Bryon -

Here are some generalizations. Actual performance can vary with quality of
construction, installation variations (e.g., radial placements), and
differences. Note that antenna performance is a very volatile topic with
hams, so I've put on my flame-retardant jumpsuit prior to making these

Both of the verticals mentioned so far (BW and AD5X) are similar in that
they are shortened (i.e., not a full quarter-wave long) and loaded (i.e.,
using a loading coil to adjust impedance so as to "lengthen" the antenna).
This loading reduces efficiency, but that's the compromise you make for a
smaller antenna. The differences are in type of construction, portability,
and where the loading coil is. (The AD5X is center-loaded. I believe the
may be base-loaded.) Both depend on ground radials. My guess is that
performance will be pretty similar given similar ground radials, with a
small difference depending on actual length.

The Buddipole (in its basic configuration) is a loaded dipole--again,
loading coils (one in each leg) to "lengthen" a physically-short antenna.
The loading will again reduce efficiency when compared with a full-size
dipole. One problem with dipoles is that their performance at lower
(less than about 1/2 wavelength) tends to favor energy directed towards
sky rather than the horizon. Verticals have more energy towards the
at low heights. (It all depends on whether you want DX capability or NVIS.
Maybe this lack of low-angle radiation of a low Buddipole is the negative
you've heard of.)

By the way, Budd also has a vertical version of the Buddipole (called the
Buddistick), and my guess it would be comparable to the AD5X design.

The Hamstick is the ultimate base-loaded vertical. It's designed for
length and maximum durability, as it is intended for mobile use (at
speeds) as-is. Since it's the shortest, its performance will be the worst
the verticals mentioned, regardless of installation.


--- In, W7RIV <nnegrom@...> wrote:

Thanks for all the great suggestions. The APE will only be the major part
of a Saturday and maybe half a day on the Friday before. I'm still unsure
if I can stay as long as Sunday. We'll have to see on the conditions and
the availability of the cabin. I will be in the woods with AC Power on

I thought of a G5RV but I'm really new to amateur radio, I took my tests
the end of 2011. I'm still a little uncertain on how the Dipoles work.
a smart guy, I'll figure it out. I thought this might be a good way to
figure that out. I will be in a cabin in the woods with AC power. So that
will be a bit of a luxury for me. I planned on running an extension cord
a tent/canopy by the lake and operate from there.

I use a Cushcraft R8 at home and I'm also looking to improve that.
reason I wanted to start playing with antennas early. The hamsticks seem
very compact, how well do they work? I've heard good and bad things
buddipole so honestly I wanted to stay away from that. Seems like the
hamstick on a riser of somesort connected to a tripod would be easy,
I get a better signal with some of these other suggestions like the Black
Widow Vertical or AD5X vertical?

- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 8:51 AM, David Westbrook <dwestbrook@...>wrote:


I did my first APE last year -- and it was actually a driving reason
getting to be mobile/portable-capable ...
I don't intend to do a lot of mobile/portable operating, so this was
for proof-of-concept rather than best antenna/power source/etc .. But
was easy, cheap, and fun!

For antenna, a 20M hamstick mounted on the back of the subaru wagon
~$20 online (mine came from High Sierra). I've since gotten the 40M &
hamsticks, too, and the quick-disconnects.

For power, got a 8Ah battery, also ~$20 online .. this lets me do
too (didn't have an easy/non-intrusive way to wire directly to car
For the APE, i actually ran on house power -- just sat inside, and ran
out to the car. (also can't put antennas up at that location, so
on car works great)

Only have one rig ... to make it easy to just literally
either home-qth-base-station, or mobile, or portable, i mounted it to a
custom wood box, and it drops into a heavy-duty plastic case. Here's my
writeup of that project:
Only real cost was the orange box for ~$30.
The digital & CAT interfaces are in the wood base.

070 #1041

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 9:18 AM, w6qe.milt <w6qe@...> wrote:


I just posted some pictures and building instructions for an antenna
I built and have thoroughly tested in my back yard, for portable
use. It's in the FILES section, "Black Widow Vertical". It was
one of our own, Ed, WA3WSJ, 070-295, who knows more about portable
than anyone I've met thus far. He's authored books on portable op's.
antenna covers 20, 30 and 40 meters and radials can vary from 6 for
put-up and take-down to 36 for an extended operation. With the
the MFJ telescoping pole, it was all built from parts in my junk box.
It's just another idea of what you can/could do for an APE operation.

--- In, W7RIV <nnegrom@> wrote:

Hello everyone. I'm a new member (070# 1481). I learned about the
through PSKFest and I had a lot of fun. I've since emailed with a
people and even had one of my first QSO's with W1IPS and a few of
the PSKFest.,

I have since found out about APE and I'm very excited. I've started
plans. I know of a great place in the woods about 40 miles of Salt
City, Utah in the Rocky Mountains. I've started reading all the
the past APE's and I would be interested in what a easy to use,
and low cost antenna would be to activate with in August.


- -
73 de Bryon/W7RIV

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